Panlab: Brewing IDEAS

zoom has a lot of new features and thus constraints---there is no such a limitation before https://support.wharton.upenn.edu/help/zoom-faq

If "Optimize Screen Sharing for Video Clip" is greyed out, the Host must allow only one person to share a screen at a time, rather than multiple.

zoom now has more network diagnosis tools (can also enable diagnosis data viewer)

Network Test
Run a test to measure your network performance and identify bugs.
Test Type: Network Information MTR Service Status

Phone Test
To test the quality of your network, your microphone will be accessed to simulate a call.
Test Type: Network Information Audio Quality

Meeting Test
To test the quality of your network, your microphone and camera will be accessed to simulate a virtual meeting.
Test Type: DNS Proxy TLS Web API ZC Connect MMR Statistics

Mesh Test
Evaluate your mesh network's performance in your recent meetings, gaining insights and metrics.
Test Type: Mesh

good to empower power users with advanced test by mtr, certificate, ping and traceroute (plus tcpdump for the famous ptt)

https://github.com/princeton-cabernet/zoom-analysis

This repository contains tools to analyze various performance-related metrics of Zoom meetings solely from packet traces of Zoom traffic. The tools allow inferring the types of media (audio, video, screen share) used, media bit rates, video frame rates and frame sizes, user participation (muted, speaking, silent), and network-related metrics such as frame-level jitter and overall latency from .pcap data captured using, for example, Wireshark. We also provide a Wireshark plugin to analyze Zoom traffic interactively using the Wireshark UI.

The techniques used to extract these metrics and make inferences based on them are described in our paper:

Oliver Michel, Satadal Sengupta, Hyojoon Kim, Ravi Netravali, and Jennifer Rexford. 2022. Enabling Passive Measurement of Zoom Performance in Production Networks. In Proceedings of the 22nd ACM Internet Measurement Conference (IMC ’22), October 25–27, 2022, Nice, France. ACM, New York, NY, USA, 17 pages. https://doi.org/10.1145/3517745.3561414

https://support.zoom.us/hc/en-us/articl ... ecognition

Using gesture recognition
Last Updated: June 20, 2022

Participants can give more visible feedback through gestures by using gesture recognition. This feature translates a real-world gesture into Zoom’s existing reactions, allowing for visual gestures, such as a raised hand, to automatically display a corresponding meeting reaction and allow users to more easily react during a meeting or webinar. Currently, this feature is supported for Raise Hand and Thumbs Up reactions.

Account owners and admins can enable or disable, as well as lock, this feature at the account and group level. By default, gesture recognition is disabled at the account and group levels but enabled for accounts that have meeting reactions and webinar reactions turned on.

Notes on using gesture recognition

• Gesture must be performed with video on and within the video frame captured by Zoom.
• Only one hand must be visible and away from your face and body.
• For the Thumbs Up reaction, it is best to have the thumb in the upright position.
• For the Raise Hand reaction, it is preferable to use your left hand on the left side of the screen and your right hand on the right side of the screen. In both cases, your palm should be facing the camera and flat. A notification will appear when recognition begins, allowing you to stop the gesture if not intended.

now provided by zoom and allowed by uvic to enable for individual account

Join different meetings simultaneously on desktop
Allow user to join different meetings at the same time on one desktop device

This feature is only available with version 4.1.28245.0717 or later.

pan wrote:

uvic zoom now allows host to record the meeting to the cloud (finally) with watermark, and the recording will be deleted after 7 days as specified by uvic admin

also uvic zoom has been integrated with echo360 and brightspace, so record to cloud can appear in echo360 automatically for brightspace https://echo360.ca/settings/zoom-settings

Zoom Settings
Automatically transfer all your Zoom Cloud recording content to your Echo360 library

Automatically copy Zoom recordings to Echo360
Toggle on to automatically copy all of your Zoom recordings to your Echo360 Library.

Automatically create Zoom lessons in Echo360 sections
Use the Meeting List below to map your existing Zoom meetings to Echo360 course sections. Section lessons are created after each meeting has completed. Meetings are always copied to your Echo360 library. For more information on using the Zoom mapping below, see our online help article.

https://learn.echo360.com/hc/en-us/arti ... 0052919752

Echo360 allows you to map your existing scheduled Zoom meetings into existing Echo360 sections. Once mapped, Echo360 automatically creates new classes in the selected Echo360 section and automatically publishes the completed Zoom recordings there. If mapped to a section, your recordings will reside in BOTH your Echo360 library as well as the targeted section.

uvic zoom now allows host to record the meeting to the cloud (finally) with watermark, and the recording will be deleted after 7 days as specified by uvic admin

Optional Reclaim Host when rejoining
When the original host of a meeting rejoins, they are now given the option to reclaim host controls or remain as a participant or co-host, in order to not disrupt the current host. This feature requires version 5.8.3 or higher and will not be immediately available, as it is dependent on a backend server update currently scheduled for November 14, 2021.

web browser can access zoom meetings but cannot support breakout room. please use a desktop client or mobile app whenever possible to join breakout rooms too

thanks fei for providing his viewpoint on the same zhumu meeting by windump

, ping

and tracert

, and from my viewpoint

$ ping -c 5 103.218.218.237
PING 103.218.218.237 (103.218.218.237): 56 data bytes
64 bytes from 103.218.218.237: icmp_seq=0 ttl=48 time=210.497 ms
64 bytes from 103.218.218.237: icmp_seq=1 ttl=48 time=208.207 ms
64 bytes from 103.218.218.237: icmp_seq=2 ttl=48 time=208.107 ms
64 bytes from 103.218.218.237: icmp_seq=3 ttl=48 time=211.401 ms
64 bytes from 103.218.218.237: icmp_seq=4 ttl=48 time=208.030 ms

--- 103.218.218.237 ping statistics ---
5 packets transmitted, 5 packets received, 0.0% packet loss
round-trip min/avg/max/stddev = 208.030/209.248/211.401/1.419 ms

and

$ sudo tcptraceroute 103.218.218.237
Password:
Selected device en0, address 192.168.1.49, port 61269 for outgoing packets
Tracing the path to 103.218.218.237 on TCP port 80 (http), 30 hops max
 1  192.168.1.252  4.337 ms  4.615 ms  4.536 ms
 2  70.66.224.1  15.416 ms  17.056 ms  15.373 ms
 3  rd1cv-be125-1.gv.shawcable.net (64.59.161.241)  14.533 ms  17.600 ms  16.170 ms
 4  rd1lp-be1.gv.shawcable.net (66.163.72.22)  15.326 ms  14.537 ms  19.221 ms
 5  rc1wt-be40.wa.shawcable.net (66.163.68.18)  19.923 ms  17.656 ms  19.250 ms
 6  rc3sj-be60.cl.shawcable.net (66.163.75.90)  39.946 ms  36.952 ms  37.732 ms
 7  219.158.33.73  38.434 ms  38.800 ms  47.484 ms
 8  219.158.98.9  181.608 ms  182.685 ms  183.725 ms
 9  219.158.3.145  180.709 ms  183.538 ms  185.237 ms
10  219.158.5.145  186.924 ms  183.509 ms  186.871 ms
11  219.158.19.226  220.689 ms  218.203 ms  211.453 ms
12  221.4.0.206  214.705 ms  216.792 ms  214.170 ms
13  157.255.159.242  237.707 ms  237.272 ms  236.838 ms
14  * * *
15  * * *
16  * * *
17  * * *
18  103.218.218.237 [closed]  204.362 ms  202.899 ms  203.003 ms

yes, zhumu (so zoom) does support the client-server==server-client mcu routing too

zoom removed itself from chinese market but left with a bunch of oem partners, each with a different client but with the same zoom code base too

https://zoom.com.cn/en-us/oempartners.html

e.g., zhumu uses udp port 8801 as well

19:32:23.343431 IP 89.95.158-98.q9.net.8801 > paneth.57925: UDP, length 230
19:32:23.345786 IP 89.95.158-98.q9.net.8801 > paneth.57925: UDP, length 89
19:32:23.350651 IP 89.95.158-98.q9.net.8801 > paneth.57925: UDP, length 49
19:32:23.360527 IP 89.95.158-98.q9.net.8801 > paneth.57925: UDP, length 221
19:32:23.361861 IP 89.95.158-98.q9.net.8801 > paneth.57925: UDP, length 57
19:32:23.361864 IP 89.95.158-98.q9.net.8801 > paneth.57925: UDP, length 83
19:32:23.361974 IP paneth.63136 > 89.95.158-98.q9.net.8801: UDP, length 15

ping blocked

$ ping -c 5 89.95.158-98.q9.net
PING 89.95.158-98.q9.net (98.158.95.89): 56 data bytes
Request timeout for icmp_seq 0
Request timeout for icmp_seq 1
Request timeout for icmp_seq 2
Request timeout for icmp_seq 3

--- 89.95.158-98.q9.net ping statistics ---
5 packets transmitted, 0 packets received, 100.0% packet loss

tcptraceroute

$ sudo tcptraceroute 89.95.158-98.q9.net
Selected device en0, address 192.168.1.49, port 60872 for outgoing packets
Tracing the path to 89.95.158-98.q9.net (98.158.95.89) on TCP port 80 (http), 30 hops max
 1  192.168.1.252  4.556 ms  4.620 ms  4.539 ms
 2  70.66.224.1  14.599 ms  16.579 ms  12.995 ms
 3  rd1cv-be125-1.gv.shawcable.net (64.59.161.241)  16.181 ms  15.478 ms  19.204 ms
 4  rd1lp-be1.gv.shawcable.net (66.163.72.22)  15.299 ms  14.756 ms  14.756 ms
 5  rc1wt-be40.wa.shawcable.net (66.163.68.18)  16.695 ms  17.589 ms  16.161 ms
 6  rc2wt-be18-1.wa.shawcable.net (66.163.64.82)  22.281 ms  16.091 ms  18.732 ms
 7  rc3no-be100.cg.shawcable.net (66.163.75.234)  34.289 ms  33.141 ms  33.029 ms
 8  rc2nr-be110-1.wp.shawcable.net (66.163.76.58)  52.266 ms  50.112 ms  53.847 ms
 9  rc3fs-be25.mt.shawcable.net (66.163.76.22)  72.271 ms  74.600 ms  72.297 ms
10  66.163.66.85  73.058 ms  72.729 ms  73.148 ms
11  * ra1sh-ge4-2-14.mt.bigpipeinc.com (66.244.223.201) 77.538 ms  73.044 ms
12  rx0sh-q9-networks.mt.bigpipeinc.com (66.244.223.202)  72.220 ms  80.844 ms  71.497 ms
13  b1-2.tor1-g-b1-2.brm1.q9.net (216.220.40.165)  70.701 ms  70.715 ms  74.653 ms
14  border1-1-dist1-1.brm1.q9.net (74.200.14.210)  70.714 ms  70.723 ms  72.284 ms
15  dist1-1-access1-2-896.brm1.q9.net (74.200.10.70)  70.738 ms  70.783 ms  73.075 ms
16  67.95.158-98.q9.net (98.158.95.67)  77.544 ms  69.251 ms  71.509 ms
17  28.253.8.93  73.818 ms  71.990 ms  70.739 ms
18  28.253.8.173  80.728 ms  72.855 ms  79.968 ms
19  * * *
20  * * *

whois

$ whois 98.158.95.89
% IANA WHOIS server
% for more information on IANA, visit http://www.iana.org
% This query returned 1 object

refer:        whois.arin.net

inetnum:      98.0.0.0 - 98.255.255.255
organisation: ARIN
status:       ALLOCATED

whois:        whois.arin.net

changed:      2006-10
source:       IANA

# whois.arin.net

NetRange:       98.158.80.0 - 98.158.95.255
CIDR:           98.158.80.0/20
NetName:        Q9-NET6
NetHandle:      NET-98-158-80-0-1
Parent:         NET98 (NET-98-0-0-0-0)
NetType:        Direct Allocation
OriginAS:       AS36031, AS36030, AS27272, AS40341, AS12188
Organization:   Q9 Networks Inc. (Q9NT)
RegDate:        2009-12-18
Updated:        2012-02-24
Ref:            https://rdap.arin.net/registry/ip/98.158.80.0


OrgName:        Q9 Networks Inc.
OrgId:          Q9NT
Address:        77 King Street West Suite 4400
City:           Toronto
StateProv:      ON
PostalCode:     M5K-1J3
Country:        CA
RegDate:        

Updated:        2015-06-11
Ref:            https://rdap.arin.net/registry/entity/Q9NT

ReferralServer:  rwhois://rwhois.q9.net:4321

OrgAbuseHandle: ZQ8-ARIN
OrgAbuseName:   IP Admin
OrgAbusePhone:  +1-416-362-7000 
OrgAbuseEmail:  IPadmin@q9.com
OrgAbuseRef:    https://rdap.arin.net/registry/entity/ZQ8-ARIN

OrgTechHandle: ZQ8-ARIN
OrgTechName:   IP Admin
OrgTechPhone:  +1-416-362-7000 
OrgTechEmail:  IPadmin@q9.com
OrgTechRef:    https://rdap.arin.net/registry/entity/ZQ8-ARIN

RTechHandle: ZQ8-ARIN
RTechName:   IP Admin
RTechPhone:  +1-416-362-7000 
RTechEmail:  IPadmin@q9.com
RTechRef:    https://rdap.arin.net/registry/entity/ZQ8-ARIN

why don't they support inter-provider meeting, e.g., zoom://123456789 can talk to zhumu://1234567890 , just as xmpp for instant messaging in old days? internetwork is to connect machines and people, not to isolate them into islands or so

up here, in canada

$ sudo tcpdump port 8801
Password:
tcpdump: data link type PKTAP
tcpdump: verbose output suppressed, use -v or -vv for full protocol decode
listening on pktap, link-type PKTAP (Apple DLT_PKTAP), capture size 262144 bytes
09:02:24.041883 IP paneth.60814 > 193.123.30.5.8801: UDP, length 430
09:02:24.053861 IP paneth.57004 > 193.123.30.5.8801: UDP, length 551
09:02:24.053879 IP paneth.57004 > 193.123.30.5.8801: UDP, length 946

with the zoom server down there

$ nslookup 193.123.30.5
Server:		1.1.1.1
Address:	1.1.1.1#53

** server can't find 5.30.123.193.in-addr.arpa: NXDOMAIN

by oracle

$ whois 193.123.30.5
% IANA WHOIS server
% for more information on IANA, visit http://www.iana.org
% This query returned 1 object

refer:        whois.ripe.net

inetnum:      193.0.0.0 - 193.255.255.255
organisation: RIPE NCC
status:       ALLOCATED

whois:        whois.ripe.net

changed:      1993-05
source:       IANA

# whois.ripe.net

inetnum:        193.122.0.0 - 193.123.255.255
netname:        NON-RIPE-NCC-MANAGED-ADDRESS-BLOCK
descr:          IPv4 address block not managed by the RIPE NCC
remarks:        ------------------------------------------------------
remarks:
remarks:        For registration information,
remarks:        you can consult the following sources:
remarks:
remarks:        IANA
remarks:        http://www.iana.org/assignments/ipv4-address-space
remarks:        http://www.iana.org/assignments/iana-ipv4-special-registry
remarks:        http://www.iana.org/assignments/ipv4-recovered-address-space
remarks:
remarks:        AFRINIC (Africa)
remarks:        http://www.afrinic.net/ whois.afrinic.net
remarks:
remarks:        APNIC (Asia Pacific)
remarks:        http://www.apnic.net/ whois.apnic.net
remarks:
remarks:        ARIN (Northern America)
remarks:        http://www.arin.net/ whois.arin.net
remarks:
remarks:        LACNIC (Latin America and the Carribean)
remarks:        http://www.lacnic.net/ whois.lacnic.net
remarks:
remarks:        ------------------------------------------------------
country:        EU # Country is really world wide
admin-c:        IANA1-RIPE
tech-c:         IANA1-RIPE
status:         ALLOCATED UNSPECIFIED
mnt-by:         RIPE-NCC-HM-MNT
created:        2019-01-07T10:44:05Z
last-modified:  2019-01-07T10:44:05Z
source:         RIPE

role:           Internet Assigned Numbers Authority
address:        see http://www.iana.org.
admin-c:        IANA1-RIPE
tech-c:         IANA1-RIPE
nic-hdl:        IANA1-RIPE
remarks:        For more information on IANA services
remarks:        go to IANA web site at http://www.iana.org.
mnt-by:         RIPE-NCC-MNT
created:        1970-01-01T00:00:00Z
last-modified:  2001-09-22T09:31:27Z
source:         RIPE # Filtered

% This query was served by the RIPE Database Query Service version 1.101 (WAGYU)


# whois.arin.net

NetRange:       193.122.0.0 - 193.123.255.255
CIDR:           193.122.0.0/15
NetName:        OC-195
NetHandle:      NET-193-122-0-0-1
Parent:         RIPE-CBLK (NET-193-0-0-0-1)
NetType:        Direct Allocation
OriginAS:       

Organization:   Oracle Corporation (ORACLE-4)
RegDate:        2016-09-26
Updated:        2017-11-27
Ref:            https://rdap.arin.net/registry/ip/193.122.0.0



OrgName:        Oracle Corporation
OrgId:          ORACLE-4
Address:        500 Oracle Parkway
Address:        Attn: Domain Administrator
City:           Redwood Shores
StateProv:      CA
PostalCode:     94065
Country:        US
RegDate:        1988-04-29
Updated:        2021-01-13
Ref:            https://rdap.arin.net/registry/entity/ORACLE-4


OrgTechHandle: ORACL1-ARIN
OrgTechName:   ORACLE NIS
OrgTechPhone:  +1-650-506-2220 
OrgTechEmail:  domain-contact_ww_grp@oracle.com
OrgTechRef:    https://rdap.arin.net/registry/entity/ORACL1-ARIN

OrgRoutingHandle: ORACL2-ARIN
OrgRoutingName:   ORACLEROUTING
OrgRoutingPhone:  +1-800-392-2999 
OrgRoutingEmail:  network-contact_ww@oracle.com
OrgRoutingRef:    https://rdap.arin.net/registry/entity/ORACL2-ARIN

OrgAbuseHandle: NISAM-ARIN
OrgAbuseName:   Network Information Systems Abuse Management
OrgAbusePhone:  +1-650-506-2220 
OrgAbuseEmail:  abuse@oracleemaildelivery.com
OrgAbuseRef:    https://rdap.arin.net/registry/entity/NISAM-ARIN

and how to get there from here

$ sudo tcptraceroute 193.123.30.5
Selected device en0, address 192.168.1.49, port 49231 for outgoing packets
Tracing the path to 193.123.30.5 on TCP port 80 (http), 30 hops max
 1  192.168.1.252  4.379 ms  4.454 ms  4.383 ms
 2  70.66.224.1  21.543 ms  12.825 ms  14.620 ms
 3  rd1cv-be125-1.gv.shawcable.net (64.59.161.241)  18.397 ms  17.711 ms  19.953 ms
 4  rd1lp-be1.gv.shawcable.net (66.163.72.22)  20.689 ms  19.318 ms  22.180 ms
 5  rc1wt-be40.wa.shawcable.net (66.163.68.18)  19.213 ms  20.056 ms  23.085 ms
 6  ae22.cr4-sea2.ip4.gtt.net (209.120.141.209)  19.965 ms  19.330 ms  20.767 ms
 7  ae12.cr3-phx1.ip4.gtt.net (89.149.186.54)  58.434 ms  58.484 ms  55.347 ms
 8  140.91.195.5  55.354 ms  55.106 ms  56.042 ms
 9  * * *
10  * * *
11  * * *
12  * * *
13  * * *
14  * * *
15  * * *

and zoom stats for stereo audio

and video-optimized screen share

thanks jinwei

, fatima

and navid

Release notes of 5.7.0 (446)
General features
-Support for gender pronouns
-Scheduling privilege and alternative host between linked master/sub accounts
-Authentication profile enhancement: Domain block-list
-Consistent date formatting
Meeting/webinar features
-Custom video filters
-Request Live Transcription enablement as participant
-Pairing with Zoom Rooms on Zoom desktop client
-NDI live streaming consent
-Hide full transcript panel
Meeting features
-Share screen to all Breakout Rooms
Webinar features
-Webinar File Transfer enhancement: file type and panelists restrictions
Chat features
-Improvements to chat sidebar
-Enhanced data privacy notification for chat channels with enhanced chat encryption
Phone features
-Display additional phone numbers in user contact card
-View number of callers waiting in call queue
-Enhancements to invite by phone
-Check connection to Zoom Phone server
-Enhancement to call logs
Resolved Issues
-Resolved an issue regarding a slight delay in virtual background when joining a meeting
-Resolved an issue with the video playback feature and stereo audio in a video
-Resolved an issue regarding link preview inconsistencies
-Security enhancements
-Minor Bug fixes

thanks ansh for a tcpdump to find out the zoom server he's associated with while in india

22:33:26.749482 IP 134.224.18.47.8801 > ansh-inspiron-3576.51345: UDP, length 113
22:33:26.749610 IP 134.224.18.47.8801 > ansh-inspiron-3576.34571: UDP, length 27
22:33:26.762103 IP 134.224.18.47.8801 > ansh-inspiron-3576.51345: UDP, length 111
22:33:26.762281 IP 134.224.18.47.8801 > ansh-inspiron-3576.34571: UDP, length 277

and traceroute

> traceroute 134.224.18.47
traceroute to 134.224.18.47 (134.224.18.47), 30 hops max, 60 byte packets
1 _gateway (192.168.43.1) 8.305 ms 8.651 ms 8.706 ms
2 100.64.63.254 (100.64.63.254) 49.233 ms 56.373 ms 66.767 ms
3 192.168.34.217 (192.168.34.217) 50.313 ms 49.975 ms 50.391 ms
4 192.168.48.2 (192.168.48.2) 49.189 ms 49.030 ms 49.954 ms
5 192.168.48.33 (192.168.48.33) 49.668 ms 49.623 ms 50.939 ms
6 nsg-corporate-225.104.185.122.airtel.in (122.185.104.225) 49.374 ms 28.250 ms 29.120 ms
7 182.79.134.223 (182.79.134.223) 169.234 ms 116.119.68.60 (116.119.68.60) 182.586 ms 182.79.134.223 (182.79.134.223) 195.379 ms
8 ldn-b7-link.ip.twelve99.net (62.115.175.230) 183.093 ms 182.986 ms 183.524 ms
9 ldn-bb1-link.ip.twelve99.net (62.115.138.150) 176.930 ms 189.868 ms ldn-bb4-link.ip.twelve99.net (62.115.138.154) 176.964 ms
10 nyk-bb1-link.ip.twelve99.net (62.115.112.244) 261.713 ms nyk-bb2-link.ip.twelve99.net (62.115.113.20) 267.308 ms 267.165 ms
11 ash-bb2-link.ip.

vs what i see from victoria while in the main session

10:10:18.815459 IP paneth.64678 > 134.224.18.8.8801: UDP, length 81
10:10:18.815504 IP paneth.55795 > 134.224.18.8.8801: UDP, length 81
10:10:18.815520 IP paneth.65452 > 134.224.18.8.8801: UDP, length 81
10:10:18.894914 IP 134.224.18.8.8801 > paneth.55795: UDP, length 81
10:10:18.895338 IP 134.224.18.8.8801 > paneth.64678: UDP, length 81
10:10:18.896090 IP 134.224.18.8.8801 > paneth.65452: UDP, length 81
10:10:19.124546 IP 134.224.18.8.8801 > paneth.55795: UDP, length 81

and once i joined the breakout room

10:17:27.577900 IP 134.224.18.47.8801 > paneth.64436: UDP, length 272
10:17:27.597920 IP 134.224.18.47.8801 > paneth.64436: UDP, length 266
10:17:27.610910 IP 134.224.18.47.8801 > paneth.64436: UDP, length 64
10:17:27.618656 IP 134.224.18.47.8801 > paneth.64436: UDP, length 260
10:17:27.638720 IP 134.224.18.47.8801 > paneth.64436: UDP, length 241
10:17:27.658681 IP 134.224.18.47.8801 > paneth.64436: UDP, length 216

and if i do not join the audio

10:18:37.465004 IP paneth.49742 > 134.224.18.47.8801: UDP, length 27
10:18:37.480347 IP 134.224.18.47.8801 > paneth.49742: UDP, length 27
10:18:37.515890 IP paneth.49742 > 134.224.18.47.8801: UDP, length 27
10:18:37.531064 IP 134.224.18.47.8801 > paneth.49742: UDP, length 27
10:18:37.566834 IP paneth.49742 > 134.224.18.47.8801: UDP, length 27
10:18:37.581811 IP 134.224.18.47.8801 > paneth.49742: UDP, length 27

so it is clear that zoom allocate servers (in the same data center) for different breakout rooms, and uvic zoom (most likely due to account manager configuration) does not allow oversea users to connect to their local zoom servers

i will talk to the uvic systems admin again---hopefully our networking research people can help not only ourselves but also uvic community use networks better